Thom Hartmann: Both Parties Are NOT the Same!

A reminder posted by Democrats for Victory in 2012, a Facebook group: .....Anyone saying "both parties are the same" is horrifyingly dishonest. 

The difference between Republicans and Democrats depends on YOU!

In this clip from February 2011, Thom Hartmann addresses those cynics who say that "Both Parties Are the Same".  Nope, says Thom.  Not true, and he tells us why:

As Thom says, "Cynicism can take hold..  Some think I am naive for thinking the Democrats are any different than the Republicans.  Both are corporate-backing shills, say some.  Both parties are guilty of corruption and breaking the trust."  Well, sometimes, yes.  

But Hartmann urges people not to abandon the party that brought us the New Deal, Great Society, and other progressive legislation..  Compare them to the Republicans who dug in and yelled "No!" whenever such legislation was introduced.

No difference between the two parties?

In the first few weeks of 2009, the Democrats passed legislation to assure equal pay for equal work for women, expanded access to health insurance for children nationwide, and they passed a stimulus act that created millions of jobs and walked us back from the edge of a depression. 

In the first few weeks of 2011 (Hartmann says 2012, but this was recorded in 2011), Congress introduces legislation to REPEAL health care, and to end the public financing of elections.

Hartmann quips, "I guess LACK of insurance is what makes this country an "exceptional nation" to Republicans"

"Time to drop the apathy and time to recognize the Truth:  

There is a difference between the Republicans and the Democrats.  It's the difference between 50 million people uninsured resulting in 40,000 annual deaths vs. more guns and disinformation.  It's the difference between worker's rights and the interests of the rich and the powerful.

Show up at your local Dem party meeting, volunteer, participate! ... Take over the party!"  (Conservatives did this to the Republicans in the 70's)  (They did this in 2009 and 2010 as well, though Hartmann doesn't mention this.)

Time for We the People to take back the Democratic party.. and that only happens when you show up!

Not Everybody Likes The Road We've Traveled

The Road We've Traveled

Sigh....

"Dan" wrote after watching the Obama campaign film, The Road We've Traveled: 

"14 million more people of food stamps, 2.7 million more Americans unemployed, 103% rise in gas prices, $15,000 increase in each citizens share in the debt, 15.9% increase in Americans living in poverty. Folks this is nothing more than Bush III, wake up...".

Dan, it's hard to know what to say to people like you who are brainwashed and/or cynical. 

Were you living in late 2008 and early 2009? Do you remember what those days were like? Do you remember the fear as we watched the stock market fall and fall some more and as we watched those jobs numbers fall and those new claims numbers rise? 

Did you really have such high expectations for this President that you thought we'd have an 800,000 job loss one month (in January 2009) and an increase in jobs the next? I knew we wouldn't start adding back jobs for months due to the crisis that we were in. I, like many Americans, was afraid that it would be years, not months, before we had any job growth. 

Your unemployment number is wrong; I don't know where you got it, but you'd better stop using that source. Yes, the number of unemployed did go up before it came down, just as anybody with any brains expected. But now it has come down and it IS coming down, and quickly. We have FEWER people unemployed now than we did the week of February 12th, 2009, just a couple of weeks after Obama took office.

We have 2.6 million FEWER people unemployed than we did in October 2009, which was the "peak" of unemployment. We have 3,939,000 MORE private sector jobs than we did in early 2010, during the "trough" of jobs. What would you have done had you been in Obama's position? What do you think that McCain and the despicable P woman would have done? 

The situation of the economy was grave. The tone in the air in grocery stores, among friends and neighbors, was somber. The stores were empty. It was scary.

And today it is not. 

Do we still have many issues to address, including the increasing number of people who are now poverty level or approaching poverty level?  We surely do.   And, if I'm not mistaken, didn't a congressman prove that it was actually Bush who was the "food stamp President"?


What do you think the Republicans are going to do about all of those poor people?  Other than blabber on about "bootstraps" when they and the uber-rich have stolen all of those bootstraps?  


What do you think, Dan?  What's the Republican plan?  Trickle down?  More breaks for corporations?  You've got to be a bit daft if you believe that will help anything.   Fewer regulations?  Which ones would you get rid of?  Minimum wage?  Environmental laws?  Those 27 jobs bills, not one of which is really a jobs bill?      

Come on, really, Dan...  Were you such an Obama fan that you expected him to fix everything in one term?


The Road We've Traveled... so far.  With so much farther to go.

Elizabeth Warren takes on Mitt Romney.. and Rings the "class warfare" bell?

Elizabeth Warren.. from politicususa

Class Warfare and Elizabeth Warren:

If you really believe that Progressives/liberals/ Democrats are the people who are starting the "class war", maybe you need a different perspective, particularly if you support Mitt Romney:

This article at Politicususa sums up "class warfare" fairly concisely:          

The right has been screaming class warfare every time Warren’s name is mentioned, but what they don’t get is that most Americans have been feeling like they have been under attack for decades. The conservative agenda of keeping wealth at the top has made life harder for every other American. Elizabeth Warren speaks to and for all of those people who are fighting to survive. No one in American politics discusses inequality better than she does.

Lawrence O’Donnell of MSNBC's The Last Word recently asked Elizabeth Warren about Scott Brown’s statement that Mitt Romney is in an income category that people don’t understand. O’Donnell asked Warren if she understood Romney’s income category, and she answered:

“Yeah, actually, I think I do understand it, and that is that Mitt Romney pays fourteen percent of income in taxes, and people who get out there and work for a living pay twenty five, twenty eight, thirty, thirty three percent. I get it. Mitt Romney gets a better deal than any of the rest of us, because he manages to earn his income in a way that has been specially protected for rich folks. I think that’s wrong.”

Is Romney's "wealth problem" really such a problem for him?  Well.........

 Anyone who has watched the Republican debates this year understands that Mitt Romney struggles to answer questions about his taxes, wealth, and investments. His excuse for investing Fannie, Freddie, and Goldman Sachs when it was brought up during the most recent debate was that it was his trustee’s fault that he had these investments and a Swiss bank account. The problem is that Romney’s answers usually take minutes to deliver, seem evasive, and are never clear.

The discussion of Romney's means of earning money; his wealth, his tax issues continues in the comments. Here are a few noteworthy exchanges:

Is the way Romney earns his money "wrong"?

I’d say lots of people here think that making millions by doing hostile takeovers of companies, liquidating their assets, firing their employees, and bankrupting them in the name of quick profit is wrong. Can I get a show of hands, here, folks?

And:

 He’s never, ever had to work for a living the way most of us understand work. Apart from that, (Romney's company) Bain specialized in raiding companies for their assets, then offshoring the manufacturing these companies did, where labor is cheap and environmental regulations nonexistent. 

A conservative type expounds on the conservative talking point of "double taxation":

You guys are showing your lack of understanding/comprehension on taxing dividends as opposed to working wages. The money Romney is paying 15% tax on is MONEY THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN TAXED. They are DIVIDENDS. First you earn the money AS WAGES and pay 35%… then you invest it, taking all the risk that comes with investing. THEN, the money you make AFTER your investment, is taxed at 15%, the rate for DIVIDENDS. Elizabeth Warren is sadly uninformed. Truth is he’s paid closer to 50% tax on his money. This is the same reason Warren Buffet only pays 15% and his secretary pays 30% or more. He’s paying tax on DIVIDENDS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN TAXED. Sorry Ms. Warren, but, your lack of understanding is showing and you are either misleading folks or outright lying…

From the same reader:

...He has already paid taxes on the money he’s invested. Those are wages. Taxed around 35%. Then, he invests it. If he makes any money on the investment, he pays taxes on that. Around 15%. THE MONEY HE USED TO MAKE HIS INVESTMENT HAS ALREADY BEEN TAXED AT 35%. I don’t know how to make it any more clear. And your last statement puzzles me. Where did I say there was any problem with paying taxes on dividends? It’s YOUR contention he hasn’t paid enough. It’s taxed twice!

But there are readers who know enough not  to accept the conservative "double taxation" talking point:

 I don’t think you understand how it works. He is not paying the 15% on the principal. He is paying the 15% on the INTEREST and dividends, the *new* money. So no, he has *not* previously paid taxes on this.

And:

 I love this shibboleth from the right (and parroted above) about so-called “double taxation”. This is simply incorrect.

The original income has indeed been taxed. The NEW income (..that it emanates from net disposable income prior is irrelevant, it is new, additional income) is untaxed…until the 15% (…or 14% for Mitt) is levied. So – let me make it plain for you: The DIVIDENDS HAVE NOT ALREADY BEEN TAXED. Capisce?

Talk about “misleading”…

To summarize this:

He’s paying 15% tax on the profits and dividends from those investments, not on the amount of the original investments. Profits and dividends are earned by investors like Romney because of the hard work and sweat that the employees of those growing companies put in day in and day out. Those employees are getting taxed in the 25-33% brackets. Romney and others like him get the rewards from their work, and he pays only 15% on the profits for doing little more than simply sitting around and watching his bank accounts rise. 

The current tax structure is completely upside down. Those regular wage earners paying their 25-33% will likely never get the opportunities that the rich have to take advantage of the low taxes we have on investments. They’re living day to day and don’t have the disposable income the rich have to make those investments. They’re stuck in and endless paycheck to paycheck cycle…. which is exactly what the rich want. Out of fear of losing everything, it keeps wage earners fighting for their lives working hard in thankless jobs to cover their bills and keep food on the table. The rich benefit from the cycle, and keep it chugging by influencing government in areas like health insurance and educational financing, which are designed to keep people stuck and afraid…

The tax code should be flipped… giving middle class wage earners a chance to really get ahead… Don’t worry rich folk, you’ll still be plenty rich. Remember, you’re only paying taxes on the PROFIT you make from your investments.

From a Romney supporter:

And here's someone who supports Romney, the way he made his millions, and his ability to shelter money from taxes:

In fact he did it in a way that many people envy & then criticize. Why can’t you just be glad for an upstanding, impressive man who has done well in life & wants to share his experience & expertise with the American people? May we be saved from Obama & his “experience & expertise” for one more term. You wish this little ol’ comment would stop Romney. Not happenin. It’ll take more than you’ve got, obviously…dint forget to check the poles next week :-)

The reply:

Hiding money in the Cayman Islands and Swiss banks accounts impresses you does it? I find Romney’s practices: Self First – Country be damned. I pay a greater federal tax percentage of income than Mitt Romney tithes and has the audacity to call it paying taxes. I pay more so vampire capitalist millionaires and billionaires don’t have to – not really necessary for you to spin that for me again, N.“Why can’t you just be glad for an upstanding, impressive man who has done well in life & wants to share his experience & expertise with the American people?”

I am: his name is President Barack Hussein Obama. He has 3 years of experience as CiC.

What was the Republican party?

The Republican Party has not always been like this:

In this editorial in the Wisconsin Citizens Media Co-op, Dee Ives, who considers herself a Wisconsin old school Republican, describes how she has watched "with horror" as the Tea Party infiltrated the party of Lincoln,  LaFollette, and Reagan:  

"Over 1,000,000 WI citizens gave our Governor Scott Walker a peoples referendum on his TEA Party Budget and theft of open and transparent politics in WI. For, you see, I am a WI Republican, and have watched with horror as the TEA Party infiltrated our Party of Lincoln, LaFollette, Reagan & Thompson turning it away from exactly what we in WI stand for…Progressive People Powered Democracy. " 

"I was appalled as I watched our Senate, lead by Scott Fitzgerald, break the open meetings laws we had in Wisconsin, despite Peter Barca’s pleas, to illegally pass Act 10 as our brave WI 14 were in Illinois. But, it was just the start of the daily assault we in WI found ourselves faced with. The politicizing of our Dept of Veteran’s Affairs, wanting to cut educational funding by $800 million, raising taxes on our working poor and seniors by cuts to EIC and Homestead monies, wanting to sell State assets without a bidding process, Voter ID, every day we watched our 1st Amendment right to free speech being curtailed, locked out of our house, the Capitol , despite court orders.  We started the Senate Recalls , and many said we failed, but two of those TEA Party fake Republicans were ousted…and all 3 Democrats won back their seats." 

So, I joined the We Are WI team last summer, a non partisan group, one of the things we were concerned about was the voter ID bill, especially as many seniors in nursing homes, including many of my fellow veterans, do not have access to the documentation to get these ID’s so that they can vote in 2012. As I collected my 316 signatures to recall Walker, and 310 signatures for Lt Gov Kleefisch, I finally, almost a year later, got to meet our Governor. When I did, I told him of our Republican concerns of what he was doing cutting BadgerCare and then my boss told him I was a veteran. So, I asked him “Will you give the gift of assurance that all of the Veterans living in our State Veterans Homes will have the free photo ID so they can vote in the next election?” Gov Walker stuttered a “Well, uh” as I reminded him we Veterans all served to protect our Freedom & Democracy…and he was moved very quickly off my unit without answering. 6 veterans were outside, denied the chance to hear him speak , by the State Patrol at the doors. No wonder today I cried… "

There might have been a time when "Both Parties Were (closer than they are now but still not the same)", but that was in a good way, and those days are now gone.      

Hey News Media! Stop sugarcoating Republicans!

A good rant from Facebook Friend Andrew Rei:

"OK News: I've grown really tired of you "sugarcoating" or giving a free pass to the political party that's our biggest threat, foreign or domestic: the Republican Party!

You need to abandon this twisted sense of fairness you have and take Jane Fonda's advice: tell the truth! Conservatives/GOP have a talking point/myth regarding the "Liberal media bias"; and, because you hear them say that, you don't really dig for the whole truth about these racist, sexist, fascist, elitist, greedy, incompetent, corrupt and arrogant bastards. 

For instance: the GOP like to spout the talking point that the "economy is all President Obama's fault"; B*llsh*t! Those of us with half a brain KNOW that the GOP and President GW Bush are STILL RESPONSIBLE for our economic ills; but, you don't want to call them on their BS; frankly, Democrats, Liberals, Progressive and even MODERATE GOP VOTERS ARE TIRED OF HEARING THIS BS! IT NEEDS TO STOP! START TELLING THE WHOLE TRUTH ABOUT THESE BASTARDS!

Please share this liberally; I'd like to see this go "viral" on FB and other media platforms, if possible"

Let's remember:  Both parties are NOT the same!

The GOP Abolishing the Middle Class?

Is there a conscious conspiracy among Republicans to get rid of the middle class?

I really don't believe that there is some kind of conscious conspiracy among the majority of Republicans to get rid of the middle class in favor of a dual class system of the very rich, very privileged, and the rest of us who are starting to scrounge around in an attempt to keep a roof over our heads and food in the bellies of our children.

No, I can't believe that this is what the majority of Republicans want.  But this is what Republican policies could bring us, intentionally or not.

I'm surprised that so many have forgotten why we have a social safety net, regulatory agencies like the EPA, civil and voting rights acts, and fair wage and hours laws. None of this stuff came about out of nothing; it all came about due to NEED:  Without these kinds of programs, large segments of the United States population were struggling and suffering, or they were in danger of doing so. We have cleaned up our lakes, rivers, and air to an amazing extent over the past 40 years. Most of the elderly no longer live in abject poverty. The conditions exposed in books like The Jungle are mostly a thing of the past here... though the condition of Chinese and other foreign workers is disgusting.

Many people who follow Republican dogma have been convinced that help from the government keeps people "on the dole". Therefore, they feel justified in getting rid of those programs.

We don't want people to starve:  Does that mean we want Utopia?

Then I read comments like this one, from a Ron Paul supporter:

"Utopia can't be bought with other people's money."

Utopia?  Who is talking about Utopia?  We are talking about survival here, and perhaps a chance at a greater-than-subsistence life.  And let's not forget that much of the riches of the uber-wealthy were bought with "other people's money".. Corporations paying people peanuts, often to work long hours like dogs, while they (CEO's, officers, and stockholders) pocketed great wads of cash.  

Eric Wattree tackled this issue of the GOP abolishing the middle class  a few days back.

He starts:  

If there’s anyone left in America who, at this point, can’t see that the Republican Party is the enemy of the American middle class, they have to be either feeble minded, or harboring a hidden interest which precludes them from wanting to see. All one has to do to get a clear view of this political reality is to open one’s eyes and look at who the GOP is putting forward to assume the highest office in the land.

One is Mitt Romney, a vulture capitalist who became a charter member of the top one percent club by purchasing perfectly sound companies, firing their employees, and then selling the companies off, one piece at a time, for profit. The other is Newt Gingrich, a former Speaker of the House of Representatives who was so self-serving and corrupt that in 1998 he was forced to resign from congress by his own Republican colleagues.

These two gentlemen, and the self-serving activities of others of their ilk, are the two bookends that led directly to the 2008 collapse of the American economy, causing millions of Americans to lose their jobs, their homes, and their life savings. Mitt Romney represents the selfish capitalists who threw America under the bus for their own personal greed, and Newt Gingrich personifies the corrupt former politician who uses his influence in Congress to lobby his former colleagues to water down the law, allowing the Romney’s of the world to ply their trade.

Wattlee talks about Romney's plan to let foreclosures hit bottom:

He has absolutely no concern for the devastation and turmoil that losing a home would visit upon the lives of a family that’s been turned out into the street – and we’re not just talking about an unfortunate few here. Mitt Romney is talking about casually writing off millions of Americans as collateral damage.

Wattlee then mentions Newt's turn-kids-into-janitors-while-Dad-hits-the-unemployment-line plan:

This Republican frontrunner for president is completely oblivious to the dire straits of the average American family. His solution would make the situation worse. He’s not the least bit concerned with stabilizing the plight of poor and middle-class families. He’s only concerned with destroying organized labor by firing the father and replacing him with the cheaper, and un-unionized, labor of his children.

He finishes:

And the irony is,this GOP fixation on returning poor and middle class American families to Great Depression status has become such of a fundamental part of the GOP mindset that average Republicans, who would be devastated by such a policy, are applauding! They’ve been conditioned to hate this nation’s first Black president so passionately that they’ve bought into self-sacrifice: “Obama is un-American – he’s engaged in a socialist plot to save my family.” ...

What these average Republicans don’t understand is that they’re being manipulated. The corporate conservatives who run the Republican Party don’t care any more about them than they do black people, gays, undocumented workers, or anyone else. The corporatists are simply manipulating their anger, prejudices, and uninformed minds in order to keep the poor and middle class divided. That way, we’re so busy fighting one another that we fail to recognize that they’re cutting all of our throats....

So again, it’s time for America to wake up – and particularly poor and middle class Republicans. Because entrusting this nation and our economy to the GOP would be like entrusting our children to convicted child molesters:

THE GOP: A ONE HUNDRED YEAR RECORD OF SWINDLING THE AMERICAN PEOPLE

Anybody who thinks that "Both parties are the same" needs to read Wattlee's article.  

My Reply To A Ron Paul Supporter

My Reply to a Ron Paul supporter: 

On a thread at the Facebook page "Republicans Bigotry, Hate, Fear, Lies and Distortion", Charles wrote: "Hey us Paulbots are okay, we are all after the same goals, NO corruption? Am I right? I mean really do not let the party stand in the way... It is the individual that needs to be judged and Newt, Mitt all of them are no good. Ron is the honest one.." 

No, Charles, I am not after the same thing as Ron Paul. This is the 21st century, not the end of the 19th century, and this "every man for himself" stuff won't help us as we compete with countries that care about their citizens. It's called "Progress".

It's believing that we as a country aren't great if we have legions of people living in poverty, living without health care, living without access to good, first-class education. I do not want to be part of a Ron Paul world or a Ron Paul country. I care too much about this country, and I want to see it as great as it should be. 

About Ron Paul's honesty: If he lied about not knowing what racist ideas were published under his name, he is not honest. If he is honest that he had no idea what extreme racist ideas were being published under his name, he is too incompetent to hold public office. If you or I had something written under our names, perhaps a report for work, that had glaring errors or omissions, and our boss asked us if we wrote it, how far would we get if we said, "Yep, my name is on that report, but I didn't write it, my subordinate did. Blame him."